GNFO

Out of curiosity, those batteries state a max continuous of 60A each and 100A for 10 seconds, so per just the specs you should be seeing 240A continuous and 400A for 10 sec. Are you actually getting better than that? Also, how are you fitting 4 people in that thing? 🙂

Since it's unique to just the particular situation of starting the day at the top of a hill with a full charge, couldn't you put it in neutral and just use the brakes until you get to level ground? After that regen won't matter. That's essentially what EV cars do if they start with 100% batteries, it's just that the computer interface with the BMS is better so it's automatic. Changing the regen of the UTV would probably take a motor controller software change.

I almost wrote that it depends on the use but I didn't want to make my comment too long. I can certainly see the need for a gas engine if you're traveling a long ways and away from civilization for days. I suppose portable solar panels and battery storage would work if you're traveling to a single campsite and are staying there for a while, but I'm not such a purist that I think that would be practical in most cases. But for local work use around a property/ranch/farm, electric is ideal.

Don't know if you resolved this, but when I did my conversion with ReLion batteries, they actually had a custom profile for the Delta-Q charger they sent me to upload into the charger. I don't know what brand you used, but maybe check with the battery maker technical support?

Yes, just a standard heavy duty 15a plug. It can run a little warm, so stick to heavy duty hardware. I actually completely replaced the end of mine by running it to an RV type receptacle I mounted on the right side. Just cut off the plug and wired it to the receptacle. Now i just plug an extension cord into the side of the UTV.

It's gotten simpler since that first post now that GC2 form factor batteries are available. But to your comment, this is a one-time thing and is frankly because HiSun went with older technology batteries when it came out. Now to "fill up" I just plug in to an outlet at the end of the day. No going to the station to fill up cans of gas, no fumes, no noise, no oil changes, no maintenance issues with all the additional little parts that keep a combustion engine going and tuned up, no worry that my UTV sat too long between uses and might not start or the gas needs stabilizer. I can even run electric loads like the light bars I installed without leaving an engine running and worrying about the little 12v battery. I've even considered adding a 2000W 48v dc to ac inverter to run power tools.

At least from what I can see, the first one doesn't ship to Australia, but maybe that's just what I see from the US with an Australian shipping location selected. What I see ships from Poland for some reason. Regarding a 50A output, that's a problem. You'd need 8 of them and space would be an issue. But maybe you're on the right path. I was wondering if something from the wild world of Alibaba might have something for Australia. It's just hard to pick good from bad and sometimes shipping has a customs or minimum order cost you can't see right away. Customer service might also be nonexistent but it depends. I bought two Tesla frunk actuator kits in 2020 from a company in Hong Kong and the guy actually answered a question I had in the middle of his nighttime. He had to do chat only because talking would wake up his wife and kid! That's more dedicated than I would be.

Might also add that this whole thread was started by @didgeridoo, but they haven't visited the site for over a year now. Despite the name, I suspect they are in the US and not Australia but those batteries came from Bigbattery.com. They don't have an AU website and for international shipping they say you have to contact them on a case by case basis. They do seem to have more options now than when didgeridoo did the conversion and some of them could actually get up to the 400a max, just not with the GC2 form factor.

Yeah, I already discussed this one when @HiSUNFarmboy mentioned it earlier in this thread. That recall was 1-1/2 years ago and they had already fixed the problem just before I bought my batteries. Unfortunately I think ReLion only had a distributor agreement with RJ for Australia. I'm guessing the logistics and cost of getting lithium batteries into Australia is "challenging" for various reasons. Probably why ReLion had to use a distributor in country instead of selling directly, or why the battery lineup on the LiTime website is so much more limited in the Australian version vs the USA version. I don't know if HiSUNFarmboy found an alternative, since he's on your side of the world. Seems like you, him, and @mark walkom are all dealing with the same roadblock. A year and a half ago here in the US it took me a while to find batteries that could be put together for 400a continuous. There are multiple alternatives available here now, but unfortunately the Australian market seems to be lagging. Not much help, I know. You actually have an importation problem instead of a technical problem! Osney's solution might work for you if you can find a surplus/salvage Low Speed Vehicle (that might just be a US term) or EV battery, but from a technical standpoint it's not for the faint of heart.

Well, at least you got a definitive answer - even if it is that they are covering their legal behinds. Doesn't help you, but I don't think they're looking to the future. As "applications" go, powering a UTV isn't much of a stretch beyond their original intent of golf carts. I don't think the other battery you mentioned is much of an improvement on theirs. If you are at the point of having to pick something right now, 200A will work most of the time, but steep slopes with a heavy load might be challenging.

Don't have a lot of examples of 200a batteries, but from what I've seen here none of the 100a (or lower) batteries seem to advertise a limit to just the amps of a single battery. It is probably why some (like the ones I use) will bother to say what maximum number of their batteries can be wired in parallel. Since Giant does advertise that up to four of their 200a batteries can be wired in parallel, that's why I would want to actually ask a technician from their company instead of just a customer representative. Exchange emails with someone who actually knows the internal logic of their BMS.

It is possible that this manufacturer has decided to program its BMS this way to limit their liability. I found this article to be helpful: https://www.master-instruments.com.au/tech-talk-article/3/explaining-the-limits-of-lifepo4-batteries-in-parallel.html On its own, there shouldn't be a limit to parallel batteries increasing the available amps, but manufacturers can be worried about variations in individual batteries leading to an overdraw on the better performing battery. If all the batteries in parallel have the functionality for their BMS to communicate with each other, you wouldn't need to worry about charge balancing and such. My 48V ReLion batteries have a CANbus system for that precise purpose, although they still limit the number of parallel batteries to 8. If what the manufacturer of the batteries you're looking at is saying is true, they don't do that and are minimizing their warranty risk. If you have no other options, 200a will work (and I see they allow a surge of 400a for 5 seconds), but you might have to go slower on the hills. The original Discover batteries only shows a max continuous of 100a (for 88 minutes), although I was able to find info elsewhere that they have a max discharge of 1050a for 5 sec. Can't really tell how long they could theoretically put out 400a, but I doubt it's for long. Of course, the Giant rep may also not really understand what they're talking about and are playing it safe. Maybe ask for further information from an actual engineering contact in the company? Just not sure if the person you talked to was only customer service with a set of info sheets in front of them.

That looks pretty good as long as you can make it fit. Two of them would give you a lot of range. Just make sure you get bigger cables to parallel them so they can handle to current. I doubt the regen is capable of 400A. That's the max the motor can take as an input, so regen is going to be no more than ~60% of that max due to different losses in the system. Probably even less than that, and I would guess the motor controller would limit the regen anyway because the old Discover batteries wouldn't have been able to handle it.

I'm not sure why it is, but the LiTime website for Australia doesn't show any 48V models, but they do have free online shipping (I guess assuming the stock is in the Australian warehouse). In fact, the selection for Australia is just a fraction of the same company offerings in North America. Sorry if that's a normal occurrence there, but it might be worth reaching out to them to see if you can order the 48V GC2 form factor model from them directly. Maybe they can throw it on their next inventory shipment to Australia.

If that's the case, then the LiTime seem good. Do they have free shipping there?Both manufacturers have free shipping in the U.S. I started out looking at cheaper lower voltage batteries, but the problem is when you wire in series you can't go higher than the ah capacity and max continuous rating of each and they don't add to each other. That makes it difficult to make use of the full 400A rating of the motor. That's why I never understood why the old Discover cells were considered OK, since their max continuous output was only 100A. Guess they were depending on the time limited higher current output.

HISUNFarmboy, that recall is from a year ago. I actually discovered it just weeks after I had installed my RELiON batteries and my serial numbers were in the group. I was quite mad at the time, but as it turns out, they had already fixed the problem and the serial numbers on the stickers on the batteries have an "S" or an "M" after them to show they have been modified. That explained why they had been unavailable for a few months before I could order them in Feb '23. They had already been fixing the problem before the recall came out. By the way, the additional serial number stickers they provided with the literature (I'm assuming for fleet owners) didn't have those letters, you had to look at the actual stickers on the battery. Even if I had been affected, they would have paid for shipping and modification. I was just upset at the potential time loss and timing, but as I said they had already fixed the problem. Bottom line: that recall isn't a problem for you unless for some reason the local Aussie dealer keeps old inventory and never took care of having RELiON modify their stock. Here in the U.S. I was buying them straight from the company. Go with whichever brand you want and don't let the recall stop you. Given your location, I suspect the LiTime batteries are cheaper. The RELiONs have some additional features like the on/off switch, 10 year warranty, CAN Bus connections between batteries so the BMS can interface with each other, and the "fuel" gauge that talks to all connected batteries through the bus, but they are definitely more expensive. At the time I bought them, RELiON was the only GC2 form factor option with 100A continuous output per battery capability and has been very responsive, but their management and engineering are based out of the U.S. I believe LiTime is based out of China, which may work to your advantage.

Obviously a little hard to troubleshoot without seeing what you have set up, but regarding the additional wires, since each battery is in the 48V class it doesn't matter which battery you connect them to as long as you keep the + and - straight like before. Just guessing, but if you don't have them connected right now you may not be getting power due to a controller power issue. Other than that all I can offer is to recheck the connections and make sure the 12v battery is still good.

🙂 No worries. I figured you must have done it properly since you didn't fry your charger or motor controller. Just didn't want someone else to go down the wrong path! Looking at Litime now, I believe I did look at them before, but at the time they didn't have a 48V-class GC2 form factor battery. I believe the ones you have are rated at 80A continuous output, which should give you 320A continuous for the 400A rated motor. Maybe somewhat more since I think I read somewhere that the motor controller can utilize the slightly higher voltage, but I'm too lazy to do the math right now. The ReLion batteries I used are rated at 100A continuous each, which is one of the reasons I picked them, but I think the moments where the motor controller actually pushes 400A to the motor are pretty rare and certainly compared to the Discover cells, 320A is like night and day.

Jamie - I'm glad you're happy with your solution, but quick question: You said you wired the four 51.2V batteries in series. That would result in 30Ah of capacity at 204.8V. They should be wired in parallel for the 48V HiSUN system. Are you sure about how you wired them? The Discover batteries were wired in series because each of them are only 6V, so 6V x 8 = 48V.

HiSUNFarmboy - It sounds like you actually had better luck with your Discover batteries than me. I never had good performance up slopes with mine and within a couple years I didn't even dare try going up a slope with a load, which is why I took the plunge for the conversion. I continue to be perfectly happy with the ReLion batteries. I'm sure I don't use mine as much as it sounds like you do, but every time I take it out to crawl around the steep wooded slopes on our 5.5 acres it's been flawless, and on many occasions I've loaded up the bed with split firewood and towed a 5 foot cart also filled with firewood with no appreciable effect on performance. Pretty much all my use is in 4WD Low, but I have been able to hit the 25mph speed limiter on flat asphalt with two people. It can't keep 25mph up a steep slope with two people, but I suspect that's more of a HiSUN issue than the batteries. I especially appreciated that ReLion was able to answer my questions and send me the files to flash the existing onboard charger for their profile. If you go with them, do get their "fuel" gauge, which interfaces with all the batteries through the CANBus (the percentage and amp hours remaining are nice to see), and the remote cable to turn them off/on is a nice to have only because the batteries will eventually turn themselves off if they sit unused for a few days without being plugged in. Of course, if you use it and plug it in every day then it doesn't really matter. Also, four is the minimum I would go with to make best use of the maximum current draw of the UTV motor. If you need more range than I do, you can always add more batteries later (up to 4 more), but since they're fairly expensive I didn't want to pay for more capacity than I needed. I don't know how cold it gets where you are, but if you park your UTV outside all the time just keep in mind that all Lithium batteries have a problem charging below freezing unless there is a supplemental pack heater like EV cars have. I believe the ReLion onboard BMS will stop charging to prevent damage, but it's better if it can be inside a garage and just left plugged in. I think they were working on a version with internal heaters too, but at the time I was looking they didn't have a 48V version yet.

That link doesn't show the full technical specs of the battery, so I can't tell. In particular, I would want to know the dimensions to see how much you would have to modify the trays (and vertical space), and for output what is the max continuous output (amps, not amp-hours like you wrote). Together, the Discover dry cells supposedly only put out 100a continuous but they do have a combined capacity ah rating of 170-200ah. I went with the ReLion Insight 48V batteries because they individually have 100a max continuous output rating, and with four of them in parallel I get to the 400a max of the motor. In theory I could have replaced all 8 of the dry cells with a single battery in the same form factor of the Discover batteries, but that would have only given me 30ah of capacity. Using four gets me up to 120ah and 400a continuous output. To answer your direct question, yes a single lithium battery could replace the 8 dry cell batteries, but you also have to look at continuous output (amps) and storage (amp-hours).

John M - I know you just addressed Didgeridoo, but FYI I haven't had any error codes since I swapped out my batteries for the lithium replacements.

There's this thread, which I contributed to a few months ago: I replaced my Discovery batteries with four ReLion Insight 48V batteries, which have the same form factor as the old batteries. I went with them because of that, but mostly because each battery has a max continuous output of 100A, so the four of them combined can match the full 400A capability of the motor. Also their tech support was great and sent me the new charging profile and instructions so I could flash the existing onboard charger to change it over to their custom lithium battery charging profile. The fact that you can still see 400A with your original batteries is interesting, since I was never able to see that and was at the point of the UTV slowing down and throwing error codes when hauling uphill. The upgrade isn't cheap, so you may want to make sure you're at the point where you just can't squeeze out anything more from your old batteries. That said, the performance improvement is great. Four batteries is plenty of capacity for my use, but if you require maximum range (and don't mind the cost) you can actually parallel 8 of them and still save almost half the weight compared to the Discovery batteries.

Been a while planning this. I bought a used "Axis" E1, the version of the Hisun E1 that used to be sold through Lowe's. I like it a lot and use it for hauling firewood and a log splitter around my property, but it always threw the low voltage alert under load going up hills and would slow down to a crawl or even stop if it had been used just a little. While the Discover lead-acid batteries were probably failing anyway, I have to wonder if the OEM batteries were the wrong choice from the beginning since I don't think they are capable of much more than 100A continuous output, well below the 400A motor. After extensive searching online for a 48V setup that would be both easy and capable of a 400A continuous output, I found the ReLion Insight 48V LiFePO batteries. They actually have the same standardized GC2 exterior dimensions as the Discover batteries, so no adapting was necessary for the trays. I went with their 4 battery bundle which included a digital "fuel" gauge, two dummy spacers (which I didn't need) and an offboard charger (also didn't need, but a good backup). Their technical support was very helpful and actually sent me the zip file to update the existing Delta-Q onboard charger profile for their batteries (profile P269). I pulled out the old batteries and connected the new batteries in parallel in the four battery positions near the centerline using new cables of the same uniform length. I did re-use the cables for the final connection to the motor controller. With these new batteries, they also come with CAN cables to connect all the batteries together. That way the onboard BMS built in to each unit talks to each other, and the "fuel" gauge also connects via CAN so it gets the total picture and doesn't have the same problem mentioned above by Didgeridoo. When it's turned on, the gauge detects how many batteries are connected and reads out a digital percentage and total remaining amp hours. Pretty neat system. I kept the blinking green light from the onboard charger since it still works and lets me know if the Delta-Q charger is properly providing current, but I got rid of the decal below it and installed the round digital gauge in it's place. Turned on the batteries (they have their own on/off button if you want to isolate them), turned the key, and it all worked perfectly. Loads of torque, no low voltage battery warning, and full advertised speed available. Plus, the four new batteries weigh 138lb total vs 520lb for the old Discover batteries. As mentioned before, the existing instrument cluster battery level isn't accurate, but I don't care since I now have a digital percentage to look at. The amp output gauge does work though, since I believe that is reading from the motor controller. Before the conversion, I couldn't get over 100A output, after the conversion I've seen it up to 300A and I haven't really pushed it yet. The new batteries are 48V, 30ah, so I have a total capacity of 120ah right now. Can't tell you the range under the manufacturer's flat, paved, medium speed, 2wd conditions, but I did do some distance with two people (~400lbs total) in 4wd low over bumpy and very hilly terrain. I estimate I would have had a maximum range of about 12 miles under those tough conditions. That seems more than enough for my purposes, but if I wanted to invest in it, I could add another four batteries for a total of 240ah. The batteries and cables were still cool to the touch after that trip, by the way. As expected, they're expensive (4 battery bundle is ~$5300 USD), but the setup is so much more capable now and the UTV plus batteries are still much less than the Polaris lithium version UTV - even if I did add another four batteries. I could include pictures, but since the batteries have the same outer form, there's actually not much to see other than four empty spots. The top hold down brackets of the inner four batteries ("H" shape) don't quite work with the buttons/lift brackets of the new batteries, but since I only had four to deal with, I just used the straight hold down brackets from the outer batteries and it works just fine and doesn't move.