Shock Idea

[Guest Lenny]

INSTALLED!

What a pain in the A**! The bolts holes were the toughest part of the entire upgrade. Alignment, size & etc. But it is finished.

Major upgrade! But interesting, the feel is stiffer. Before the front shocks were stiff with the rear being soft, too soft. Now it is BALANCED, but a bit on the stiff side. I took a little ride and it is much, much better. The ride on pavement is just like a car. Washboard is not even a issue, almost like pavement. Rode out thu the rough stuff and went thu dips, drops & bumps and where I backed off in the past, I never let up. Never bottomed out or over extended. Excellent but feels stiff. In fact feels twitchy on the smooth stuff. Since the feel is so balanced, I am going to soften/back-off the springs on both the front & rear. (side note the rear ride height is now a bit higher) I put the new shock location at more of an angle to maintain the travel since the shock was move towards the rear & lowered the upper mount to capture some of the travel when I lowered the diff mount. I installed the upper mount inside of the lower mount to keep from hitting the rear tire in compression, very important.

In summary, Better, much much better. I am softening the springs so the damping of the Fox Shocks can work MORE. Level of pain doing this mod, A LOT! But worth it, not easy. Very pleased with the final product.

PICS were TAKEN and will be uploaded.

rocmoc n AZ

Rocmoc, mine is cushy when I push down on the rear. You should be able to push the rear down probably 2"-3" anyway. I went out and took a measurment for you. I pushed the rear down and let it come back to its natural position. After that I stood on the rear hitch ball and the rear went down about 1-1/2". I weigh 180#. I'm going to think outloud here for a minute. If I'm at 180# and I push it down 1-1/2" then if I were to push down with 360# it should go down about 3" assuming your not getting into the primary spring with a 2 spring setup. I feel mine is still a little stiff but it is getting real close. I'm assuming that your using the stock spring and if so I measured mine at about 600# per inch. If you do try to measure it under the hitch like i did, be sure to corral the spring at both ends. I corraled it only at the top side figuring it wouldn't kick out at the floor side. I was wrong and It kicked out with about 900# on it and at first thought it broke my arm. Dumb, Dumb, I know better but out of laziness convinced myself it would be OK. Anyway, if you know the spring rate your using, as an engineer, you should be able extrapolate (not sure about the right use of that work or spelling) the aproximate next spring rate you should be looking at. I find that it is far better to be on the soft side and stop it with the compression dampening then the other way around. Also consider eventually adding bumpstops. That way you can sort of have the best of both worlds. A great soft ride that takes most everything you throw at it and if you take an extra big hit, the bumpstops catch it and you still don't bottom. I ended up buying a variety of dampening washers of different sizes. It's not that hard to change the dampening once you have done it a few times. The washers are cheap and you can get the combinations off the Fox site so you will know exactly what to change. Also then get at least a quart of shock oil for Fox shocks. Having just one shot at a free dampening change will probably not be enough to get you where you want to be. Remember that the stock ride is so bad, it's easy to be impressed with anything you do to improve it. After time, you will become more critical as you notice things about your ride that could be improved. After all, were not Flatbed and able to zero in after 2 or 3 trys. I don't think he can even do it that easy. It's a lot of trial and error, Flatbed just knows better where to go next then we do. I may have some softer springs you could try that I could bring to Yuma but you would have to eventually send them back to me. I would need to know what lengths you could use. I must have 12-15 pairs that I need to put on ebay some day to get my money back out of them. Good luck.

Lenny

[rocmoc]

Thanks Lenny. My ride today was without any of the stuff that is normally on the rear, spare tire, ice chest & etc. All this adds about a hundred pounds which will make some difference as it is directly over the rear shocks. I will add all that stuff tomorrow and give it another go. Backing off on some of the pre-load will help but will not be the same as changing out the springs. My goal isn't to get it perfect but to correct the incorrect loading point on the swing-arm causing twisting of the arm & improve the damping. I had little damping before or never had much. Pretty sure I will be able to soften the damping but that descison will be made after the Lake Havasu to Yuma trip. There will be plenty of terrain to test on that trip for every situation. I am close enough as $ & time will go next into power steering & doors.

Thanks again,

rocmoc n AZ

[rocmoc]

Second thought, I am going to disconnect one of the new shocks and compare the two side. After your post Lenny, I went out and pushed/jumped on the corners of the suspension. Rear is STIFF and I am not sure if it is damping or springs. So I will disconnect on shock tomorrow. Thanks for the thought that was generated by your post. The front is OK.

rocmoc n AZ

[Guest Lenny]

Second thought, I am going to disconnect one of the new shocks and compare the two side. After your post Lenny, I went out and pushed/jumped on the corners of the suspension. Rear is STIFF and I am not sure if it is damping or springs. So I will disconnect on shock tomorrow. Thanks for the thought that was generated by your post. The front is OK.

rocmoc n AZ

Dampening won't play that big of a difference at slow compression of the shock. Its effect increases as the speed at which the shock compresses increases. That is why you can have fairly soft suspension that feels good as your putting around but when you kick it up, it catches much bigger stuff. When I stood on my hitch ball I didn't have any of the aditional weight on either. It feels spongier when I add that but still only goen down about 1-1/2" when I stand on it. Keep in mind that if you have a 100#/inch spring and you push on it with a 100#, it compresses 1". Now if you load it with 200# it compresses 2" and then add another 100# it compresses another 1". That is of coarse if the spring is linear. So, my thought is that you need to be able to compress it some even though it is not loaded with your stuff.

Lenny

[rocmoc]

Great results. I took off the shock and it is softer. So I let off all gas from the stock Joyner shocks and that help a surprising amount. There was movement when I jumped up & down on the rear where before it didn't hardly move at all. There is sway as I go around a corner now. SO after the LH to Yuma trip I will remove the shock and take them with me back to Off-Road Warehouse. We will be within a few mile of their location in Jan. I will drop them on Wed and Pick them up on Fri. They are currently 50/70 and I will at least be going 40/60. Between now and then I will back off some of the spring pre-load which will help a little. Good thing is if I did nothing else, I am happy with the results. Everything from now on is icing!

Took it for a ride and speed is such that it would be easy to break something else. I don't have to slow for any of the dips, jumps or things I did before. This lends itself to pushing the equipment beyond the normal designed use and WILL result in failure. That was just a test and will not be driven that hard 98% of the time.

I will upload the pics soon.

Power Steering & Doors next.

rocmoc n AZ

[rocmoc]

Pics

[rocmoc]

An added note. If you notice the angle of the coil-over shock relative to the Fox shock, the coil-over has more lay down angle in it's new location. This was to try and pick up some of the lost travel when I moved the coil-over shock rearward. I lost a small amount of travel but not enough to notice.

rocmoc n AZ

[rocmoc]

Worked on the Trooper today. I adjusted the spring load on both front & rear shocks. Finally backed off / soften the rear shock by around 1 3/4" and 1" in the front. Still have 12" of ground clearance. I am amazed how much the springs are loaded. I backed off the rears over 3" and still had load but lost too much ride height. The angle on the CV axles is now much better. My feeling is Joyner cranked up the load on the shocks to get the ground clearance they wanted without regards to design. Ride is much improved. Tomorrow I will install the Fox shocks in the rear and bleed off a little N2 from the front shocks. Then I will finally be finished with the ride & shocks. Next will move on to the gas tank, needs a new routed filler tube or fuel cell , and the doors.

rocmoc n AZ

[Mopartist]

Worked on the Trooper today. I adjusted the spring load on both front & rear shocks. Finally backed off / soften the rear shock by around 1 3/4" and 1" in the front. Still have 12" of ground clearance. I am amazed how much the springs are loaded. I backed off the rears over 3" and still had load but lost too much ride height. The angle on the CV axles is now much better. My feeling is Joyner cranked up the load on the shocks to get the ground clearance they wanted without regards to design. Ride is much improved. Tomorrow I will install the Fox shocks in the rear and bleed off a little N2 from the front shocks. Then I will finally be finished with the ride & shocks. Next will move on to the gas tank, needs a new routed filler tube or fuel cell , and the doors.

rocmoc n AZ

Lookin great Roc!

[rocmoc]

FINISHED!

Perfect is what came to my mind as I was making the last & final test drive. I have a set of bumps & dips I have been using for my benchmark. When I started the rear of the Trooper would Rodeo thu the low point of the dips. When I would hit the bumps it was harsh and I could feel the hit.

NOW, the dip is absorbed & dampened like a off-road racing truck you would see on Speed. The bumps, I can hear the hit but NOTHING or nearly nothing is felt. I am very very pleased.

Final setup,

Rear is double shocked using the stock Joyner shocks as the spring setup with very little or no dampening. I bled ALL of the N2 pressure off of the shocks. The Fox shocks' dampening is adjusted to 35 / 55 (compression/extension). Front tire pressure is 13 1/2 lbs. The load on the springs was backed off 1 3/4" to 2" softening the load on the springs & lowering the ride height.

Front is the stock Joyner setup. The load on the springs was backed off 1" softening the load on the springs & lowered the ride height. I lowered the N2 in the stock Joyner shocks to 5 lbs. Tire pressure is 10 lbs.

I am DONE with the shock project.

rocmoc n AZ

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[Jarrad]

Awesome. Sounds like a winner to me

[rocmoc]

Thanks Jarrad. It is always nice to get to the end of a project.

rocmoc n AZ

[Jarrad]

All the while some projects never end.

Let's hear the plans for the new trooper

[rocmoc]

Clean a spot in the RV garage and stick it in there. First thing I want to do is see / use the trans to ID if anything else / engine will fit. Toy, Sub, Honda, ? That is it for now. Too many other project in line before to even worry about it. Also removes a little worry on my part if I blow a diff. Nothing exciting! Maybe a rocmoc & Lenny experimental Trooper, LOL!

rocmoc n AZ

[Jarrad]

TR1100 XPLR

That's what I am talking about

[G-Pa]

TR1100 XPLR

That's what I am talking about

I'm with Jarrad. He knows me as Warren not G-Pa.My Trooper 2 is still under the wrenches,due to my health. My son is my mechanic and the T2 is an in between from his regular job and his projects. My Troper was purchashed from No Limits last year about the time Joyner America folded. Add ons were all handed with Jarrad. Have to give him a "good "ATTA BOY" for his help. Good luck with the project. Before and after pics would be nice.

[rocmoc]

G-Pa, look up my profile. There are pics in my gallery and thu-out my posts. I will try to add some more current pics to my gallery.

rocmoc n AZ

[G-Pa]

I read the forum every day and and as I'm retired some times more than once When I said pictures, I was refuring to the new t2. My build is a slow one due my health. DO have uneased turbo with intercooler and pipe from ebay my son designed. Power steering,heater.Wheels are ITP 7T with beadlocks.Tire are interco trxus-sts 29x11x14. Stock tires were tearing up the driveway. 2 fire extinguisure bracets,1 for extinguisre,1 for my portable oxygen tank. Would I behijacking if I put my son's web page to show what he does when not at his 9-5 job? I have more accessories to go. try to do pictures when our snow is gone Tanks for your time.

G-PA

[ricksrb]

TR1100 XPLR

That's what I am talking about

TR1100 SDT (Super Dupper Trooper)

[Jarrad]

That's not half bad either. You taking notes rOcmoc?

[rocmoc]

Going in the RV garage & gather dust! Nothing exciting, Sorry!

rocmoc n AZ

[rocmoc]

I read the forum every day and and as I'm retired some times more than once When I said pictures, I was refuring to the new t2. My build is a slow one due my health. DO have uneased turbo with intercooler and pipe from ebay my son designed. Power steering,heater.Wheels are ITP 7T with beadlocks.Tire are interco trxus-sts 29x11x14. Stock tires were tearing up the driveway. 2 fire extinguisure bracets,1 for extinguisre,1 for my portable oxygen tank. Would I behijacking if I put my son's web page to show what he does when not at his 9-5 job? I have more accessories to go. try to do pictures when our snow is gone Tanks for your time.

G-PA

Sounds like it is going to be a Super Nice Trooper or a Trooper SN.

rocmoc n AZ