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2001 3010 Mule

Dennis Knepp

By Dennis Knepp
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Dennis Knepp Contributor

Dennis Knepp

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New guy here,  my question is, is vapor lock common on this machine? When I run it for a while and shut it off it will not restart if it sets for 5-10 min. I have to lift the dump box and let it cool for approx 20 min before it will start. I replaced the fuel pump thinking it might be the problem. Any help would be appreciated.

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kenfain
kenfain

I'd hose it down inside, and out with carb cleaner. Pull the bowl off, and hit the needle and seat. Along with all the holes I could get to, including the jets. Then put it back on, and see if it help

Dennis Knepp
Dennis Knepp

I drove it around yesterday intentionally allowing the time it took to over heat. 5-6 times it started, yippee🙂😁👍 

Travis
Travis

May also be the ignition coils failing when hot, let em cool down, they work great, heat up, no spark.. Woops, ignore the above, I misread your problem. But I would check for spark when it w

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Travis Grand Master

Travis

Posted
Posted

May also be the ignition coils failing when hot, let em cool down, they work great, heat up, no spark..

Woops, ignore the above, I misread your problem.

But I would check for spark when it won't  restart, if it has spark, then it's a fuel issue... I would feel of the carburetor float area to be sure it isn't hot enough to keep you from touching it.

 

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Dennis Knepp Contributor

Dennis Knepp

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It gets hot you dont wanna stick your hand in there. I have spark the coils are under the cylinders its cooler there, would be odd for both of them to fail at the same time. It dont quit it just won't restart after setting for 10 min after turning it off. I thought there might be people  out here with the same issue that might have tips or trick other than lifting the box every time you stop. If you get back in within 3-4 min it starts right up.

kenfain Experienced

kenfain

Posted
Posted

I've never heard of vapor lock on the older mules. Vapor lock wasn't very common in older cars, but it certainly did happen. Seems like it was mostly a model specific thing. As some models were prone to it. And it might be common across a lot of examples of that particular model. Others never had a problem.  On one old truck of mine, the fix was using one of those spring loaded wooden clothes pins.  Just clipped it to the gas line near the carb. It worked as a heat sink.                                    I'm sure that you've looked up the cause. So some possible solutions might include.  Trying a cooling fan after stopping. Reducing the cooling time.                    Try idling the engine for a couple of minutes before shutting it down when it's hot.             Reroute the gas line away from hot manifold. Or if its a metal gas line, you could replace it with the rubber stuff. Or try insulating the gas line.                               Have you tried pulling the breather, and looking down the carburetor throat to see if it gets a good squirt of gas when it's doing this?

Dennis Knepp Contributor

Dennis Knepp

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Not that!! Ok either fuel pump relay which I dont think would be affected by heat or the igniter that is on the flywheel. That would require removing front driveshaft and shifting mech to get the flywheel cover off. I'll see if my local dealer can order one. Toodeloo

  • 2 weeks later...
Dennis Knepp Contributor

Dennis Knepp

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Does anyone have a part # for the pickup coil on this 01 KAF 620E 3010? I think I've replaced everything else that might cause it to not start when the engine is warm. The manual calls it a pickup coil but I'm unable to find it by name anywhere. Any help would be Appreciated.

Travis Grand Master

Travis

Posted
Posted

21121-2092  COIL-IGNITION    spacer.png

Or it could be referring to the igniter, which is basically an electronic points set that "tells" the coils when to fire... does the manual show a picture of it?          spacer.png

3010.PNG.d46ee1ec254121bfec35314bc0996ccb.PNG

21119-1583 for the igntiter.  
Travis Grand Master

Travis

Posted
Posted

3600 is pretty much the standard for Max rpm for small 1 or twin cylinder engines,  Some manufacturers will governor them to 3600Max, but they are usually safe up to 3800-4000 rpm... 

 I was told this by a guy I know who is a Briggs and Stratton MST,, Kohler and Briggs and Stratton found that with the RPM set at 3600 is  where the highest torque/power produced at the lowest revolutions... So in a sense more efficient and less wear on the engine.

Dennis Knepp Contributor

Dennis Knepp

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OK!  New pickup coil installed. No help! What I have found in all this is it does NOT fire till I let off the starter. Depending on the throttle position when I let off the starter it will fire up, about ¼ down, at ½ it floods, at no pedal it just spins free like no compression.  Is that a relay issue or a starter problem?

Had a Kohler with that issue once, I run a hot wire to the coil with a switch on the dash, problem solved. Killed the battery if I forgot to turn it off. This isn't a lawn mower and I'd rather not Jerry rig it.

HELP!!! Would be appreciated. 

  • 4 weeks later...
Dennis Knepp Contributor

Dennis Knepp

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OK, replaced pickup "coil pulsing" no change.  I've replaced both ignition coils with cheap Chinese  jobs, no change. ( that rear coil is a challenge, but doable.) I can't think of anything else that might be affected by heat buildup after shutdown. Any more ideas?

kenfain Experienced

kenfain

Posted
Posted

Have you tried Travis's suggestion? You'll need to narrow it down to a single issue. Then work that issue. 

I doubt that it's a compression problem. So you should focus on the other two for now. If it has a carburetor, then checking for gas is easy. If it's injected, it's more complicated, since you'll be working on it while it's hot. Mine is diesel, so it's obviously injected. And TBH, I really don't know when the gas mule went to FI.

So if it's a FI system, I'd start with electrical. Pull a plug wire, and check for spark. Do it when it's hot, and is demonstrating the no start problem. It's essential here, that you use a spark tester, that'll show how much power the spark has. You can't go by the color for this test.

Dennis Knepp Contributor

Dennis Knepp

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  • Author
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OK, replaced pickup "coil pulsing" no change.  I've replaced both ignition coils with cheap Chinese  jobs, no change. ( that rear coil is a challenge, but doable.) I can't think of anything else that might be affected by heat buildup after shutdown. Any more ideas?

kenfain Experienced

kenfain

Posted
Posted
  On 8/9/2020 at 3:06 PM, Dennis Knepp said:

It's got a carb, my biggest problem is working on it alone, cant be in the back and front at the same time.

Expand  

I feel your pain. Ever since I moved to the country, I've had to learn ways to do things alone. I'm assuming that you mean having access to the ignition switch. If that's the case a remote starter switch should do the trick. At least for this project. I'm sure you can make one easy enough. Unless you think that you'd need it enough to justify buying one. Or possibly remove the back screen for a reach over the seat access. I'm not sure just exactly how your engine is situated. Mine is mounted sideways, directly behind the cab. Remove the screen, and the bed. You'd have easy access from the seat.

Back to the carb... when it's not starting, have you manually operated the linkage while looking into the carb? It should deliver a healthy squirt of fuel. Or try starting fluid. If the fluid works, then you can be fairly certain that it's fuel related. 

Dennis Knepp Contributor

Dennis Knepp

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Pulling the screen was going to be my next move. I have a BIG problem with replacing parts and covers and shields. Takes ½ hour to get to the carb by then it'll start😂, I live on a gravel road, dont wanna run without air cleaner. If I lift the box every time I shut it off it's not so long for restart, but its gotta be empty or everything goes to the back.

So I'm thinkin the screen's comin off today. When I ask my wife to help she tells to take it to someone who knows what they're doing 😂

kenfain Experienced

kenfain

Posted
Posted

You could try having all but one bolt already removed from the breather. Or tape it down temporarily. Or using some foam as a temporary breather. You could even warm it up by letting it idle for awhile. 

You'll probably need to have an empty bed for this. Because you'll need to pull it back as far as it'll go, and tie it back. That prop bar won't give you enough working room. Pre install a couple of C clamps, and have a tie rope ready. 

After getting it to temp, just pull in, tie the bed back, and pull the minimum number of breather bolts. You should still have plenty of time for doing the tests. Although probably not all at once. Might take a few tries. 

Travis Grand Master

Travis

Posted
Posted

One thing you might can do is carry a can of starting fluid or carb spray/parts cleaner with you,  kill it, and if it doesn't restart, try to shoot some  straight into the air intake and if it fires up, most likely a fuel issue...( I'm not sure how easy the filter is to remove on this engine, so it may not be a feasible a task...)

something makes me think it may be running lean.... Have you looked at the color of the spark plugs?

 

 

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