COLEMAN UT400 Fuel indicator

[NewtoUTV]

aefron88,

Fuel is not full, I did check the connection under the seat at the fuel tank today.  I tried to remove the pump module but could not get the ring to twist with the tools I had.  Going to try this again with different tools.  I will also look at the speed sensor.  Appreciate your help.

[Greg Kilgore]

Recommend a brass or non-metal chisel or punch. And a non-metal hammer when trying to get the ring off fuel tank. 

 

NO SPARK TOOLS!!

 

Don't want to go BOOM.

 

 

[Greg Kilgore]

Here are 2 pics of my gauges.

This one shows fuel tank full. Well has enough gas in tank to register full.

 

This one shows about 1/2 tank.

And when the fuel gets really low the little fuel pump icon will flash.

[NewtoUTV]

Greg,

That is helpful, so mine must be stuck at full.  It has never moved from what my photo show.  

[NewtoUTV]

Today I pulled the seat and took all three hoses and disconnected them from the tank and also the plug.  After doing this this is what happened when I plugged the plug back in.  In the past what's in the video never happened before, so maybe its fixed.  We will see after I drive it for a while.

 

 

[Greg Kilgore]

What's the level in the tank now.

 

When it was flashing the red bar and fuel pump icon. That indicated an empty tank. Then it started walking to full tank. Never seen that before. Was cool.  Hopefully just disconnecting and reconnecting helped to clean the connections.

 

Did you take multi meter reading on the sending unit/float side?

[NewtoUTV]

Thats what happened when I disconnected and reconnected.  The tank is pretty much full 

[aefron88]

17 hours ago, NewtoUTV said:

Thats what happened when I disconnected and reconnected.  The tank is pretty much full 

But I thought the issue was that it's reading full when you don't think the tank is full?

Or have you gone thru a tank without it changing? If that's the case I would still pull the sender and play with the float and see if the gauge changes as you move the float. It's also possible the float is stuck at full for some reason.

[NewtoUTV]

I have gone thru a 4 gallons without it changing.  I am assuming the sender and play may have released its self when I was messing with everything.  We will see.
 

[NewtoUTV]

I ran this machine today for 1 hour and no change in the fuel indicator!  There has been other issues with it also, that I have not posted.  I have had it with it!  It continues to pop out of gear constantly and today it decided to just stop running and will not start.  Battery has 12 volts and it just clicks when you try to start.  Submitted a support case with Coleman asking for return and refund.  I am guess I will not get a reply.  

 

[aefron88]

Sounds like you have a lot of issues with your UTV. If you can return it for a refund that may be the best bet.

If you want let me know and I'm happy to help you further troubleshoot.

My first impression of the no start video is either a bad battery or loose connection, based on the fact it tried to start and seems to lose voltage as it tries to crank. Batteries can show 12+V and still not put out the cranking power needed to run the starter.

[Greg Kilgore]

I understand your frustration. 

You may want to check the terminal connections AND the big power connections on the frame, solenoid, and starter. Possible put a trickle charger on the battery. 

 

My brother puts permanent leads on his motorcycle battery with a quick connect plug. Quick connect plug similar to a trailer light connector. That he leaves connected to the battery and just tucks the plug out of the way when not riding. Then he just connects to one of those solar panel chargers or trickle charger. Just to maintain the battery. 

 

I noticed the snow flying so temps are a little cold. The battery could be a little weak. Anything less the 12.4 volts with a sitting battery and the battery is considered drained. It's possible that a little charge and the machine will fire right up.

 

My mower has a weak battery. It spins the starter fine. But not fast enough to "spin" the gear up the shaft of the starter to engage the flywheel. Every now and then I have to charge it.

 

I hope you get a response and they make you happy. It took me 10 days to get a response for my request for a mobile tech visit for my warranty issue. No tech yet just a response saying they are trying to schedule someone.

 

Just a thought. Hope all works out for the best.

[NewtoUTV]

The battery thing started when I was driving it, after about 1 hour.  It just stopped and then wouldn't start.

[aefron88]

Well that sounds like an entirely different issue if it died well running.

Have you checked the fuses inside the fuse box as well as the inline fuse on the battery cable?

[NewtoUTV]

Haven't heard from Coleman, image that.  So, I tried to start it today and it just clicks, this is the part that the sound comes from.  The fuse that is on that line is good.

[aefron88]

Yep that's the starter relay. Just to confirm you checked all the fuses in the fusebox under the seat?

Once you confirm those are good, do you have a way to charge the battery or jump start it using a car battery? If all the fuses are ok the battery may be shot, even if it shows good voltage.

My thought process is it's very possible there's an issue with the charging circuit and your battery may not have been charging while the engine was running, but we can cross that bridge once we get it running again.

 

[Greg Kilgore]

It took over 8 business days for Hisun to send me an email. And this is a short week. So it may take a little longer.

 

Since the starter relay solenoid is clicking. There is voltage going to the relay from the key switch. 

Since the lights dim/go out on the dash. There is a large amount of voltage going through the relay to the starter.

Since the starter isn't spinning and bendix isn't engaging the flywheel on the engine. I'm going to say the battery is weak.

The engine will run as long as the battery has voltage even if the charging system (stator, rectifier, regulator) isn't charging the battery. 

 

Usually the rectifier and regulator is one unit.

 

To trouble shoot you need to get the machine running first.

Charge the battery.

Put a multimeter set to DC volts and see the volts the battery has. Should be 12.5 to 13 volts.

Disconnect multimeter and start the engine. 

Once the engine is running for a few minutes. Check voltage again. Should be 13.5 to 14.5.  But either way write down the reading.

Have someone increase the RPM and write down voltage again.

With engine running and lights on. Write down voltage. Leave lights on and increase the RPM and write down voltage.

 

Unlike a car the sxs has a stator that generates variable AC voltage. The rectifier converts AC to DC voltage. The regulator gives a steadier amount of DC voltage (less than 15 DC volts).

 

It's possible when you were working on the fuel sending unit. Disconnecting hoses and electrical connections. Or checking the connections on the dash. That the voltage regulator may have gotten disconnected by accident and not reconnected.

 

Item 2 on this page

https://alpha-sports.com/coleman_parts.htm?q=coleman_parts

Show to be the voltage regulator under the hood. Part 24 shows to be a 30 amp fuse and from the looks of it. Should be on the starter relay solenoid.

 

I'm not at all familiar with this machine. This is just from general knowledge of simular engines from yamahas to outboards.

I will try to help where I can. There are ways to check voltage from the stator but requires more dedicated equipment. Not a lot of money. Less than $30 but can be a little dangerous since it is AC voltage. But we can troubleshoot that later if needed. First would be to check all fuses, check all connections and grounds. A multimeter is a must. 

Let me/us know what you find out.

 

When you first turn the key switch to on, do you hear the fuel pump kick on, then kick off?

[Greg Kilgore]

The starter solenoid works like a electric magnet.

The key switch supply a small amount of positive current to the solenoid. Usually the negative comes from how the solenoid is bolted or secured to the frame.

When the key is turned to the start position and the current from key switch is routed to the solenoid. It creates a electric magnet that pulls or pushes on a bar. That bar causes a connection on the large wires that go the battery and the starter.

That is just a simple explanation of how a typical solenoid works.

[Greg Kilgore]

I rewatched the video you posted with the clicking. I think I could hear the starter turn over for 1/2 second before it started clicking. Battery weak.

The popping out of gear I'm going to say is a shift linkage adjustment. Simple enough to adjust. Just got to get it running first. If you don't have a battery charger or jumper cables. Take battery out and take to local auto zone or advance auto parts. They can charge battery and test at same time. And the service is FREE. They might try and sale you a battery. But you can always say no.

 

Here is a replacement shift linkage cable. Zoom in on the ends. It looks as if there is adjustments on both ends of the cable. Haven't looked at the manual but I'd say there are directions in there on how to adjust it

 

Edited November 22, 2022 by Greg Kilgore
Add pic of shift cable

[NewtoUTV]

Greg, when I get a moment I'll see if I can adjust that cable.  I checked the battery yesterday and it now indicates 11.7 volts.  One thing I forgot to mention is when this all happened I was using the wench a lot, with the engine running.  So I am guessing that is why the battery is low, but should the engine not be charging the battery.  I will also check out the other items in your list.  Thank you

[Greg Kilgore]

The winch takes a lot of voltage to run it. 

The stator charging system charges a lot less than an alternator does.

If you were using the winch even with the machine running. Without increasing the RPMs could drain the battery to low to start. A battery with 11.7 volts is considered very weak / dead. See the chart.

I would not start adjusting the shift cable until the machine was running.

 

A trickle charger can be picked up at Walmart or Amazon for about $20-$30. They charge at low amps (2-3 usually) and new ones have a microprocessor to monitor battery state. And if hooked up for months will kick on and off to maintain the battery.

It will take a little while to charge since the trickle charger charges slowly.

Also the longer a battery sits in a discharged state. The more of a chance of hurting the battery. That is the reason boaters charge their deep cycle trolling batteries after a day of fishing. A battery can also freeze if not charged in cold weather. 

 

I got a phone charger that plugs into the 12volt power socket. It also shows the battery voltage. So I can monitor the charge in the battery. Since these machines don't have a gauge.

 

Once you get the battery charged and the machine running. You can put the multimeter on the battery. Write down the voltage. Have someone increase the rpm and watch the meter. It should also increase.

 

So let's

1. Charge the battery. Get the machine running. 

2. Then check the battery volts while running to make sure it is charging.

3. Shut it off. Remove the fuel pump. Make sure the float arm moves freely. Put fuel pump back in and make sure machine starts. I usually wait after turning key on for the fuel pump to cut off. Before trying to start.

4. Then adjust a little at a time on the shift cable. 

5. Hopefully enjoy without any more troble.

[NewtoUTV]

Greg thank you.  I'll see if I can do some of this during the weekend and then update.

[NewtoUTV]

I got a trickle charger and connected last night, this morning it started and the volt was 12.8.  In the next few days I will test.

[Greg Kilgore]

Cool. Glad it's running. Mines down for now but it's 65 out and wife and I went for a 30ish minute ride on 4-wheeler. 

If it's warm out go for a ride if not warm, bundle up. Enjoy yourself.  Glad it's running.

[NewtoUTV]

Update,  I contacted Coleman service, took way to long to get a reply.  The closest service is 100 miles away and I need to get the machine there, Not going to happen!  So I guess I'm stuck trying to fix this stuff!  It currently is not working as it will not start.  The battery indicates 12.8 volts, it will turn over but will not run. Most likely going to change the spark plug first, then look at a new battery.  I just love that this machine has not worked properly since day one,  I should have taken it back to the store we got it from.  Very angry with Coleman and as of right now will never buy any more products from the company! 

Wish someone from Coleman would scroll these post and do something about there terrible service!

[aefron88]

So what exactly happened between Nov 24h (when it was running,  correct?) And today. Have you used it at all? Did it give you any issues?

So just to confirm you have 12.8V still at the battery, it cranks over, but doesn't start? You have fuel in the tank? When you turn the key to "on" but don't crank it do you hear the fuel pump hum for 5 seconds and then stop?

[NewtoUTV]

We have been using it, about 5 days ago after about 6 trip between the house and the barn, which is 400' it just died and would not start.  Today tried to start it and it would turn over but not stay started, I purchased a new spark plug Ill install in the next few days.  The original spark plug is in the machine, so hopefully it is that.  I did try to adjust the shift cable to see if I could keep it from popping out of gear, that went so so, appear to have very little tolerance for what what to tighten the cable. 

[Greg Kilgore]

6 round trips of 400 feet in a day.

That is a lot of strain on a small battery and 400 ft is not enough run time to charge the battery.

 

When trying to start, did you try pressing the gas pedal. Had similar happen and had to give it some gas to start and keep running. Changed the fuel filter and it did help. Maybe a fuel injector issue.

 

Read somewhere there was an issue with the 400ut shifter popping out maybe on this board. The guy gave the fix. Said could be diy or actual fix from Coleman. I'll look and see if I can find it again.

[Greg Kilgore]

Here is the post about the shift issue.

 

 

 

 

[aefron88]

You didn't answer my other question, are you hearing the fuel pump come on for 5 seconds or so when you turn the key to "on" before starting? And you do have fuel in the tank correct? I'm also assuming with the key on you aren't getting any "P" codes on the display.

If all that is good I would go after the spark plug next, then valve lash (if it hasn't been checked recently), and then the injector